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[00:00:00] Mary: Hi Mary. Hello Kate.
[00:00:03] Cait: How are you doing?
[00:00:04] Mary: I'm doing well. Summer has started though. It is crazy. May
[00:00:09] Cait: I know May. Vanessa says 24 hours at a time.
[00:00:13] Mary: Oh my gosh. I'm glad we're not doing school anymore because I'm not sure why I fit it in with all the other things that we're doing.
[00:00:19] Cait: It's just, I don't know why everything has to be, it's all fun stuff, but there's just so much of it.
[00:00:24] Cait: It's all fun stuff. Everything turns on in
[00:00:27] Mary: May. Yes it does. Because everything's winding up or starting up kind of thing, so Yeah.
[00:00:34] Cait: I'm so happy to have you on. It's always good to talk to you. And you've been on sisters a few times now, right? Am I remembering correctly? At least I think so. I think we did screens and I think there was another one that I'm not thinking of.
[00:00:48] Mary: I think we did book club guides. Yes. But like celebrated book and then we've done like a group one.
[00:00:55] Cait: Yes, we did when we were away. That was fun. Yeah. Yeah. It's great to be back with a new topic. Yeah. I'm so excited. So for those who don't know you, could you tell us a little bit about yourself and your family?
[00:01:07] Mary: Sure. I'm Mary Wilson. I'm a homeschooling mom of four children who are now all teenagers, but we have homeschooled the entire time with the exception of one child who tried high school, but seven days later decided it wasn't her jam, which was fine, and she came back home. But my kids are now my.
[00:01:28] Mary: Oldest has just finished her second year of college, and I say second year because thanks to dual enrollment, she will graduate in three years. So we're like, are you a sophomore? Are you a junior? So we just say you're done year two. I feel very European. You're finished year two. And then my second daughter graduates this month adding to the fun in May.
[00:01:48] Mary: She graduates high school and then my son will be a junior in the fall and my youngest will now be a freshman in high school. So everybody is grown and yeah, it's a whole different world. This.
[00:02:04] Cait: It's bananas. I just, I think of your kids being so much younger and then I'm like, Mary's kids can't be that old, cuz that means that mine are getting
[00:02:12] Mary: old.
[00:02:13] Mary: Like, where did that all and yours, yours are, I
[00:02:16] Cait: know, signing up for driver's end and all that jazz. Oh my goodness. It was a blink. Yes. But so fun. And could you tell us a little bit about how homeschool transformed into a business for you too?
[00:02:30] Mary: Yeah. It's interesting because that was not something, especially where I am now that I ever predicted.
[00:02:36] Mary: Of course when I started homeschooling, I was a blogger, a mom with an online journal back in the blogger days of literal blogger.com and Started sharing our homeschool adventures. And then that slowly morphed into kind of more formalizing that, like really trying to provide resources for people so that they could come to my website and search and find helpful topics and information.
[00:03:00] Mary: And then social media came along. And then as the kids got older and I had more time, I decided to maybe look for less entrepreneur activities. And actually ended up working for a homeschool company for a while. And then when that didn't work out decided to go ahead and teach myself what I was most passionate about.
[00:03:23] Mary: What I most loved about the former job to take online throughout school, which is a platform where parents could take all sorts of great classes. And I thought I would start teaching book clubs because, As a homeschool mom, I had organized book clubs for all my kids for years and it was one of my favorite parts of homeschooling.
[00:03:43] Mary: I think they enjoyed it too. Yes. I know they did. I don't, I can't, they all their favorite enjoyed it cause I've never asked. We like I sharing them about it. Yeah. I was sharing 'em online and we were doing themes and I just thought, I would love to bring that love of discussing books to other families.
[00:03:58] Mary: And have that group atmosphere that for various reasons, the online platform works really well for a lot of families to be able to create that for their kids. And I've been doing that. I just finished up my second year of teaching book clubs during the school year and it has been such a great fit and I love it.
[00:04:19] Mary: And now as my kids are getting older, I'm still getting to read and discuss really wonderful children's literature that I love ya books. I love high school, but oh man, you and I were just talking. I get to talk about Charlotte's Web this summer and I'm just delighted. That
[00:04:35] Cait: is so fun. And I love I was, I had Vanessa on recently and she was talking about creativity and how important it is for moms to, yes.
[00:04:43] Cait: Make sure all homeschool parents, that you're just fueling that crea creativity so that, when we're in this space now where we're finding ourselves with more time, because suddenly you do, it's like all these years it was like go and all teaching all the things and learning all and going all the places, and all of a sudden, your teenagers are more independent and they're off doing their own things and you're left with more time.
[00:05:05] Cait: And if you don't have that, you can be like what do I wanna do when I grow up?
[00:05:10] Mary: And I am glad that I was able to foster that a little, even unknowingly, but throughout the entire journey said, I was ready to envision that as I stepped into it. Which is really nice
[00:05:25] Cait: and I love that you're taking the part that you loved and the part that you were really good at.
[00:05:29] Cait: I'm feeling a little bit of that with never board learning cuz we're making the playbooks. Yes. And we're all like the lazy unit studies that I loved and because now my kids aren't, I have two in school and then my youngest is pretty independent. We've been doing it for so long that I almost don't need to create, I throw things at him like, did you know this when he's interested?
[00:05:46] Cait: But he's so good now he's helping me create the playbooks so I can be like, doing, continuing what I liked when they are doing their own thing. And my exactly speaking of him was in your middle school book club all this year and absolutely adored it.
[00:06:02] Mary: I'm so glad we had a great time.
[00:06:03] Mary: That was a, they're all really fun groups. Yeah. Which I love. I love getting to know people I've met online and I'm getting to know their kids and it's a really Special, unique time we live in that. I get to do that.
[00:06:17] Cait: It is really cool that all the online options, I think about that a lot cuz being someplace where there's not a lot of homeschoolers.
[00:06:23] Cait: I don't know if I didn't have that. What, I don't think we would've had, we wouldn't have had as much fun, but I think I wouldn't feel as connected to the community. Yes, I do. Yeah, I, right now, when I was going on I was like, I'm starting in the podcast now. And he is and he's who are you interviewing?
[00:06:38] Cait: And I said, Mary, and he said, my Mary. I was like, yep, you're Mary.
[00:06:41] Mary: I've gone from your Mary to his Mary.
[00:06:43] Cait: I know we can share her. So I love that. One of, one of the reasons I wanted to have you on is that you, I think you're good at all books and you're like magic for picking great titles and extract, extracting the fun from it and translating it into other ways.
[00:07:00] Cait: But I think. In particular, you have, you're embracing graphic novels. And I know in talking with homeschool parents, a lot of people are like, kids are obsessed with them. Kids and teens are obsessed with them. I know. Mine are. And I think we grew up in a time where maybe that wasn't, we didn't really have them.
[00:07:20] Cait: And there's this thought, do they count? Are they quote unquote educational? Like, how do I read them aloud? How do I talk to my kid? I know personally, I never liked reading them aloud, so I would sit beside them and they'd show me parts. But it, if you're not used to that that platform of, or type of a book, like how do you embrace your kids' love of them and incorporate it into your homeschool?
[00:07:46] Mary: Yeah. There's a lot there. Yeah. I, and they have gained in popularity, which has been awesome because like you said, they're just a writing format. So you can find them in all genres. They're not, I misunderstood that about graphic novels. I thought of them, like I says genre. I don't know why, but they're not, they are a format.
[00:08:04] Mary: I think originally
[00:08:05] Cait: in the library, I think when they first started getting really, or at least I should speak in my library, when they started getting really popular, there was like the graphic novel section and there still is. Yeah. So I think that's maybe why we like compartmentalize it.
[00:08:18] Cait: Cuz it's not, they're not like Yeah.
[00:08:20] Mary: Everywhere. We don't think of them as oh, I'm looking for a great history book for my kids. I'll check out graphic novel. And we need to adjust that mindset because we can do that more and more. So for me it's been a bit of a journey getting there.
[00:08:33] Mary: And the child that most influenced me is around the corner. She can hear me talking about her, but I had a child who. That was all she wanted to read. So all my, actually, my oldest didn't really love 'em, but my other three kids really loved graphic novels. But I have one kid who insisted That was it.
[00:08:49] Mary: That's all I really wanna read. I hate when you make me read anything else. And we took a risk her eighth grade year and decided, all right, then we will only read and study graphic novels for eighth grade. And, at the time it felt scary. Looking back now at myself, I would've been like, what were you so scared of?
[00:09:10] Mary: But there are a lot of people who still feel that way. See, I'm years down the road and I've been studying graphic novels for so long that, but it was scary. Is she gonna miss out? What big literature thing, elements is she not gonna get? Because I've decided to do this and there weren't resources.
[00:09:26] Mary: I was just making it up as I was going. And I won't say I did the most spectacular job, but we had fun. It worked. So fun and it led me to seeing how rich the genre the writing format was, that there was so much we could do with it. And that of course, led me to thinking that was something I could also provide online that I did not have at the time and could start discussing graphic novels with kids.
[00:09:53] Mary: And I do a weekly book club for that. So they are valuable. Now your question, I think at the end was about reading them out loud with your kids. Yeah. That is tricky. My daughter was in eighth grade when we did it, so I read it separately from her. There are very few times I have read a graphic novel out loud with my kids because it's hard.
[00:10:15] Mary: I have done it. But it's just a whole different type. Of reading. And so you just have to be in a different mindset. Like you're gonna sit and enjoy a book together in a different way because you both need to have the book, you need to have access. So you have to be sitting together to look at the pictures and read along.
[00:10:32] Mary: And the thing with graphic novels though, a lot of times is the kids really like reading them on their own. Where a lot of times for a Read aloud book, we're reading out loud and they're cool to just do their own thing with a graphic novel. Like they want it in their hands so they can look at the pictures.
[00:10:47] Mary: So you could read it out loud or you could do a lot like we did where I read it and she read it. So we could still discuss it and talk about things in it, but we weren't trying to sit there and do it together because that is a little hard. You can,
[00:11:01] Cait: but it's hard. It's tough. I've tough, I've had parents ask about that when they've taken some of my court, one of my courses that's on reading.
[00:11:08] Cait: And I always think about the magic school. School bus books. Yes. Which my kids loved, and the content is spectacular, but I always a, how do I
[00:11:17] Mary: read this with all the like,
[00:11:19] Cait: little bubbles and and I think it can feel a little bit like that. But I really like when you share a book with your kids that you're not reading aloud, that you're both reading on your own time and then coming together to talk about.
[00:11:29] Cait: I think that's really neat. And I like that you're doing that with graphic novels.
[00:11:33] Mary: Yeah. Because then you can talk about what image did you really and what part of the book? And you can have all the same discussions that you would have with the regular book and so much more because you can get into the artwork and the graphics and the design and that kind of thing.
[00:11:47] Cait: How, so how, when you're researching them, how do you find them? Because I know so whenever people are asking me about graphic novels, they always mention Captain Underpants. And I remember it might have been Jim's release. Somebody was talking about, the literature says it's so important for your kids to fall in love with the story.
[00:12:06] Cait: So it doesn't really matter. If you wanna raise a reader, if you hate Captain, captain Underpants and you just can't stand it, it's still a value because Captain Underpants made so many readers. But I think that sometimes parents are thinking, when they think of graphic novels, they're thinking about those early quirky ones.
[00:12:25] Cait: Yeah. That maybe seem less educational even if they are finding love of reading. So how do you find good quality ones for your, like what are your sources?
[00:12:34] Mary: Oh, so many sources. I'm on a lot of email lists. I just do a lot of searching. Like I will look for new and upcoming graphic novels and request 'em so I can read 'em, preview them.
[00:12:46] Mary: People can go to my website where I've got lots of great lists. Yep. You now having read so many good reads, just all of the places we go and the library. Now my library also keeps them separate and I scan looking for ones I haven't read. Sometimes they'll be in the library, like people will pull out bestseller or most requested or bestseller, and they'll be intermixed in that.
[00:13:10] Mary: So I'm just always looking for them. Yeah,
[00:13:13] Cait: so I, so my youngest said that Mary picks the best books and he like, and ju to my friend Kate, who is actually opening a bookstore. But you guys have that. I think if you're a book nerd, like we are, that it's very hard to find. Books that you haven't heard of before.
[00:13:30] Cait: Especially if you're like constantly using them for homeschool. And people always joke that they don't buy us books for gifts and stuff because they know that we've probably already read it. But you are someone, and Kate is someone who will be like, have you seen this one? Emmy and the, what is the title again?
[00:13:44] Cait: Cuz you just told me. And the Kia code. I'm terrible at titles. My family loved this one and I hadn't heard of it before. And then you did it in the book club this year with my son and he was so excited that it, I get to reread it. I remember this one, it's been a while And this is a really good book.
[00:14:00] Cait: So I
[00:14:01] Mary: just thought, yeah, that's a fun one. Different writing format cuz it's free verse poetry. Which is another whole really unique cool one to explore.
[00:14:09] Cait: And they like if you told them that some kids would probably be like, ugh. Free verse poetry. I don't wanna read that. But you just be like, look at this cool book.
[00:14:17] Cait: And then they're reading poetry, they don't even know it.
[00:14:20] Mary: Eight and such great plots, which is often the case with graphic novels. And though it did take me a little while, it's a different kind of format. I still remember the first one I finally read. I pulled out one from the series.
[00:14:32] Mary: I don't have it here. Just when we talk about incorporating graphic novels and it's a different format. One of the great things is it does hit all the genres. This is history and non-fiction and they are Nathan Haes Hazardous Tales. This is one of them. The first one is actually one Dead Spy.
[00:14:51] Mary: The first one I read was Treaty Trenches, mud and Blood. And I did it because I was teaching my kids about World War II and my boys knew everything. They were just like spouting all facts. And I was like, how do you know this? And they were like, from our graphic novel. And I was like, alright, I give in, I'm gonna read this graphic novel.
[00:15:12] Mary: And I won't say, I was like, oh my goodness, this is the best book I've ever read. But I was like, oh my gosh, I get it. I get it. This is entertaining. It's easier to remember. The facts are interesting, and it was presented in with humor. And I was like, okay, there is something to this, the format.
[00:15:31] Mary: And of course Nathan Hale Yes. That, that I just loved. And it started unlocking that idea of these books being useful for educational goals that I had, not just what my kids pick for free rating. And that was a big shift for me. Like I think we could actually do a lot in education with these graphic novels.
[00:15:54] Mary: And that was the first time that shifted.
[00:15:58] Cait: I love that story. I years ago we tried one co-op and it didn't end up working out, but it was a history, an American history co-op. And so when we went to like preview to see if it was a good fit, we went to one of their sessions and it was on the battle of Bunker Hill.
[00:16:14] Cait: And my oldest just knew the ants, kept raising his hand, and the other mothers were like, way to go, mom you're rocking history. I was like, we haven't covered any of
[00:16:21] Mary: this. He was
[00:16:22] Cait: like, it wasn't my mom, it was Nathan Hale and everyone's just dying laughing. And a couple people, I hadn't heard of him.
[00:16:28] Cait: I was like, you might wanna check
[00:16:29] Mary: him out. Yeah, it's true. And he is fantastic.
[00:16:33] Cait: Yes, and I think the cool thing about graphic novels is the images. I would think help your kids remember more of the facts. Just having it, it's like a visual storyline in front of you. It's not just the
[00:16:45] Mary: words. For a lot of kids, like I said, my oldest didn't really like them at all.
[00:16:50] Mary: And I don't think it's something. I liked exposing her. I usually had her read one each year. Just pick an interesting one because I think ex just like exposing our kids to all genres even if they don't like them, is just as important, is important to exposing them to all different writing formats.
[00:17:07] Mary: So some kids are dying for them and that's what they wanna read all the time. And other kids, it's just an exposure that this is another way to tell a story or to share information. So for our visual learners, especially that. Cooking information through the graphics, but even for our other kids. And that's one of the reasons I love graphic novels is we are in a world where visual literacy is so important.
[00:17:33] Mary: Like how to see images in front of us and make inferences and draw conclusions and understand what's being said via an image that graphic novels are just such a natural way to practice that skill. And of course we're doing it in an educational setting, so we're often doing things like one of my favorites, I have a, I have so many sitting here this one very cute little boy superhero.
[00:17:58] Mary: He has powers he can't really control. Hence the big hole in the wall. But there was visual foreshadowing in the book. Nothing was mentioned about this drone that was like flying outside the bus window and then several pages later it becomes a huge part of the story. But if you're clued in and you're looking at those images for details, that's the kind of stuff we could talk about is what do you think's gonna happen with that drone?
[00:18:22] Mary: Because it's not there by mistake. Just like we talk about in a novel that, okay, they didn't say that by mistake. They're letting us know there's something to come. In a graphic novel, we're doing those same things, but we're doing them visually, which is just a whole other way to think about the same goals, foreshadowing, all that kind of stuff that we wanna talk about with our kids.
[00:18:43] Cait: I love that. As you're talking, and I know I didn't put this on the questions or anything, but I'm thinking about all the the concern about AI in the media and how that is visual. And you're gonna need to be really aware and a critical thinker when it comes to things that you're presented with. So I think right.
[00:19:02] Cait: This could be a way to prep for that too. Just as
[00:19:04] Mary: you're starting to just get kids to think about what they say, critical thinking about
[00:19:09] Cait: it. Definitely. What are some of your other favorites? Because I love when you shared with you. Okay. Okay. And I know that all the poolside professional development listeners are like, you don't have to have your pens out cuz it's all gonna be in the show notes, but,
[00:19:23] Mary: okay.
[00:19:23] Mary: I pulled out Okay. Super was one of my personal favorites. In fact, the first guide I wrote to help parents discuss these with kids, this went in it because I thought this was such a good one. And the other one that went in it, that was one of my favorites was this one measuring up a daughter is wearing this one.
[00:19:42] Mary: Yes, she moves to America. So you've got like this cross-cultural thing going on. She loves cooking and she's got her grandmother's influence from Taiwan and she loves Julia Child. And so you have that cross-cultural connection and she enters this cooking contest and she's trying to find friends. And there's just so much good stuff in here to discuss both content.
[00:20:05] Mary: And then of course the graphics that, those are two that I love. I will, and I pulled out for you my, so at the end of the year, I let my students vote on their favorite graphic novel. I loved that you did this. Yes. And I, and we read 28 during the year and in the eight to 10 year olds and in the 11 to 13 year olds, the winner was Cleopatra in space.
[00:20:31] Mary: If you're seeing this visually, this. Video, all these Post-it notes are all the things I wanna talk about when I, so just ignore these. But this is a series, so the fun thing about it and so it's Cleopatra from history, but it's in the future. It's a science fiction, so it's fun. Like you have the pyramids and the spinks show up, and so you're getting these like illusions to the historic Egypt.
[00:20:55] Mary: Ancient Egypt, but yet it's all in space in sci-fi. So this was hands down the favorite. So another really good one, and then I'll give you another one. Yeah. This one this author, PASU Kaci wrote a very popular series called Amulet. Oh, people love
[00:21:16] Cait: the name. Yes. That's a frequent flyer here.
[00:21:18] Mary: Oh, yes. And Explorer is a series he wrote.
[00:21:22] Mary: There's three Explorer books. And what he did is he took, and this is what I love about these books, is he took six other graphic novel writers and he gave them the same prompt. So it's like giving a writing prompt assignment. And the prompt is the mystery boxes for this one. There are three, two other prompts in the other series, and they all have to write a graphic short story.
[00:21:45] Mary: So it's, you're getting into short story, you're getting to see all the different interpretations of this prompt, the mystery boxes. And then you're getting to meet other graphic novel writers. So you've got one that looks like this, bright and cheery colors. And then you've got another one that's written with a totally different.
[00:22:03] Mary: Mood again. We wanna talk to kids about mood, how to create mood. We do that with words and novels. We do that visually in a graphic novel. So without even reading, what kind of mood is gonna be in this one versus what kind of mood is gonna be. And for people who are listening to this, the first one is just very dark black pages.
[00:22:25] Mary: And the second one, it's very bright colors, white space around the panel. I recognize
[00:22:30] Cait: that art, which the bright one who is. The other one that you showed, who, what author
[00:22:35] Mary: was that? Yeah, the bright one. I don't Oh, Reiger. Oh. Who's written a ton of graphic novels. And that's the thing too, you start to recognize, it's like recognizing a novel the writing style.
[00:22:48] Mary: You start to recognize the art style and we'll talk about that a lot too. Oh, that's so cool. So these,
[00:22:54] Cait: that's my daughter's. Which favorite? She's always sh Rain is as old as you are. I can tell. Like she's always talking about the same things. I think you'd be friends.
[00:23:02] Mary: She like an eighties, nineties kid.
[00:23:04] Mary: Yes. I think she was. Yeah. So tho those are some of my favorites. I have more, but you know what, I will go through a few more because Yeah. I will also explain again, why there's such value in these books. So another reason I think these are so great for homeschoolers to embrace the, this format is for our older kids.
[00:23:23] Mary: They can really provide a foundation for more difficult literature later. So for example, you can find Shakespeare in graphic novel format. And so you can read it that way and have these rich discussions and then when they encounter the book, it's oh yeah, I know this story. And they have something to like hook on that you can find here's The Hobbit.
[00:23:45] Mary: So before you tackle that book, you could read a graphic novel version or read 'em both and discuss the differences and what you enjoyed about each one. And putting visuals, comparing the graphic novel to the movie because they're both visual, is another fun thing to do. So I just think even as our kids, that needs to be your next thing.
[00:24:04] Mary: I've fun many requests for like teenage classes and I'd love to get there one day. I gotta get my own teenagers outta the house. And then we talked about like history. And again, no matter what you're studying, you can pull a graphic novel in One of my favorites is a memoir. And that is they called US Enemy by George Tae.
[00:24:25] Mary: Oh God. And he writes about his childhood growing up in a Japanese internment camp here in America. So after the bombing of Pearl Harbor and what that was like a time period in history that so many pe, so many history books don't even touch. And you can pull it in through a graphic reading of his memoir.
[00:24:45] Mary: Again, so much educational value that, that you can experience with your kids and learn about. And that's what like when I just started to open myself up to what was out there and I was like this is not just oh, we can do this so that the kids will, what we're reading, but there is richness and value in these books.
[00:25:04] Mary: This isn't. A graphic version of another book, like this is the only way you're getting this story. So I have just loved that. And one for younger kids was when stars are scattered. So this was another memoir about growing up in a refugee camp. And so there's pictures of the actual people in here. So after they've read this story, they, you get to know the ending and you get to see who you just read about again.
[00:25:33] Mary: I love it so much value. And of course, one of the things we all think of is engaging, reluctant readers and early readers. So I would be remiss not to discuss pb and j who are for your early readers, your, first through third grade about a p a literal green, p a b, bumblebee, and a blue j pb, and J already.
[00:26:00] Mary: It's gonna be a ton of fun. I love it. I love
[00:26:02] Cait: seeing all the titles. Do you have any what were like the frequent, I don't know if you find this, but in my house it seems like my kids reread the graphic novels more than they do the books that they've loved. Like they will reread a book, but they tend to like, like obsessively reread certain series and graphic novels.
[00:26:22] Cait: And we were just talking about this week cuz we were at the library. We are at the library book fair. And so it prompted like what they were getting rid of and we were having this whole conversation. And then we went to the library and my youngest got what was it? The Crock eight, my homework and cardboard and el deco
[00:26:40] Mary: cardboard kingdom.
[00:26:41] Mary: Cardboard. I
[00:26:42] Cait: think kingdom's a good one. Yes. And it's those are some, and when you mention amulet that just are. Constantly in our house and my daughter, the whole Rena Tel Gair, I know, I don't think is Smile A series, it might be a series
[00:26:55] Mary: Smile, her books and, oh, I forget the third one in that.
[00:27:00] Mary: But yes, all of her Clash Act drama. Yes. They're all her.
[00:27:05] Cait: Also just loves those books and just will reread over and over. And I just, I love that they do that.
[00:27:12] Mary: Yeah, there's something beautiful about being able to finish the story in an hour or two versus the novel that's gonna take a lot longer.
[00:27:19] Mary: So there's another great thing about graphic novels is you can get, you wanna discuss plot arc and get through the whole thing in a day. You can do that really quick with a graphic novel, and it's all the same elements, but I think that's what makes them so easy to read and read again.
[00:27:37] Mary: So you
[00:27:37] Cait: mentioned. In talking about the value of them and everything and why we should include them in our homeschool. You mentioned you have a resource for parents on graphic novels and another one that
[00:27:50] Mary: will, another one coming. Yes. Can you tell us a little bit about that? Yeah. I tried to write what would've been helpful for me when I was discussing graphic novels with kids, because, after.
[00:28:04] Mary: Two years now of reading a different graphic. I keep pointing to this shelf. These are all graphic novels of reading a different one every week. It's become very natural to me to be able to discuss it, but it's not for everyone. To know that diagonal lines mean action and to, talk about why there's vertical panels and that kind of thing.
[00:28:22] Mary: So what I did is I picked five, like a variety, five graphic novels, and for each graphic novel, parents get four discussion questions of just the plot, the story, that they can discuss like you would with a novel with some suggested answers. Because, I know that feeling is apparent where you're like what's the right answer?
[00:28:42] Mary: Isn't a right. There, there isn't a right answer, but there's things you at least I always like to, knowing in my head like, what are some of the things I might want my kid to recognize in this? And then I have six specific turn to this page, like the foreshadowing and super turn to this page, look at the drone out the bus window.
[00:29:03] Mary: This is, how is this an example of foreshadowing, like giving them the specific colors to look at panel shapes, sizes, ways. I always say to my students, How are the graphics helping tell the story? That's what we're trying to do. So in that guide they also get six specific, look at these pages and discuss this of how the graphics are helping to tell the story.
[00:29:27] Mary: And then I think I threw in there just because it's me, like a fun extension activity if you wanted to do it, with measuring up like baking and, that kind of stuff. Because who doesn't wanna have fun at the end? Exactly. But the nice thing about graphic novels is you can do all of that in a week if you wanted to, you could read the story, have the discussion, do the activity, and have it all done in a week, which is really nice.
[00:29:49] Cait: I love that. And you're providing, if you're a parent that's just getting your toes wet with graphic novels or you don't know where to start, you're providing them with a really solid spine. That they can.
[00:29:59] Mary: And the hopefully, while it would be great if they wanted to buy a second one's gonna be coming out in July, but by the time this is released, there should be two in my store.
[00:30:09] Mary: But hopefully they'll start to pick up on it and notice things themselves. They won't need me anymore. They'll be able to start to see the kinds of things you notice in a book.
[00:30:19] Cait: W can you tell us a little bit about what you're planning for the second one, without giving it all away, it's
[00:30:24] Mary: gonna be follow the same format, so like discussion questions, and then I can tell you one of the books that'll be in there.
[00:30:31] Mary: Oh yes. I would love that. It's here. Where is it? I thought it was, I brought it down. There's so many
[00:30:36] Cait: books. If you're listening to us, Mary is sitting in front of a beautiful bookshelf that is just loaded with fantastic titles. Oh,
[00:30:45] Mary: it is. I brought it down here. It's back here. Okay. So this was a favorite.
[00:30:50] Mary: It is called Marshmallow and Jordan, and I loved this one for so many reasons. It's magical realism, which I think is a really fun, sub genre of fantasy. So you're not in a whole fantasy world, but you do have some magical realism going on here. It takes place in Asia, so it takes us to a different place.
[00:31:12] Mary: And the main character is in a wheelchair, which again, just always looking for diverse experiences in the world. Diverse cultures. This one, and it's beautiful. It's like watercolor and it's just, oh my goodness. I'm not turning to the most beautiful images. There we go. It's just, it's got this real sense of like peacefulness and beauty.
[00:31:33] Mary: And so it's a lot of fun to discuss the artwork too. So this will be one. That they will find in the next set of five. And again, both packets right now are for tweens, which is technically ages eight to 12. But it's so easy to go up or down. And I think that's one thing about graphic novels that maybe is an advantage over other novels.
[00:31:55] Mary: Like I don't have any of my teenagers wanting to pick up Charlotte's Web and reread it. But they will. They will pick up Dogman and reread it. Yes, they will pick. That's another one, amulet and reread it. Even though it's technically a tween book, they will pick up Nathan Hale still.
[00:32:12] Mary: So I have kids who are 14 who want to stay in graphic novel club because they still love reading. Like it seems to me like the age level gets, yes, there's a reading level, but it just blends right into adulthood. Like high schoolers are still wanting to read these staying graphic novels because they love them.
[00:32:32] Mary: I don't know. There's some magic there.
[00:32:35] Cait: Do you wanna hear a funny story? I may have told thi this before, but we last winter went to visit my sister-in-law out in Colorado. And it was the first time cuz she moved right before the pandemic. So we're finally like seeing her new house that isn't new anymore.
[00:32:48] Cait: And so I had to, I brought the Kindles for the kids and I had to do like a system reboot of my oldest. It just, it like last minute you're already packed. I'm like, what's wrong with the Kindle? I did this whole thing. Yeah. And apparently I set it up wrong so that he had access to Amazon and he purchased over $200 worth of big Nate books and he read them all.
[00:33:11] Cait: He's 14 at the time. I was like, I woke up to all these notifications and I was like, what on earth? I was like, you need those in 20 minutes. So I had to like, Amazon is very nice and we'll let you return. But the funny thing is that we were like, what were you thinking? And he was like, I wasn't.
[00:33:25] Cait: And I was like you can't do that. That's a lot of money. And you've read all those books before and it's really, so don't do that. And then he went to sleep and I woke up in the morning to 75 more
[00:33:34] Mary: dollars night churches.
[00:33:36] Cait: He was like, mom, I thought I could just return
[00:33:38] Mary: them. Oh my gosh.
[00:33:39] Mary: It's not library. No. See Amazon,
[00:33:42] Cait: it was like, of all the books you chose, but that's just an example of how they loved it. And if your kids ever pull that on you, Amazon, you can get on the chat. And they were very understanding. I think I only had to pay for one. Oh, that is excellent.
[00:33:53] Mary: No, Amazon. Yeah.
[00:33:55] Cait: Like you're got. Jet lag and whatever, and he just couldn't sleep. So he had run out of whatever, didn't see anything enticing, discovered he could
[00:34:03] Mary: hack into my account. Just get big Nate. Yeah. Just like another very popular one here in the south Stew. Oh
[00:34:09] Cait: my goodness. And I'm thinking like, when my kids were little and still, they've always loved Calvin and Hobbs, and I loved Calvin and Hobbs as a kid, and that's what our graphic novels were.
[00:34:19] Cait: Were like the comics. They were comic
[00:34:21] Mary: books. Oh, which brings up a great question. What is the difference between a graphic novel Yes. And a comic book? I know. No. So a graphic novel is the entire story. It's the entire plot arc from introduction to conclusion with the climax, with everything. A comic book takes the full story and typically breaks it into smaller books.
[00:34:45] Mary: So you pick up a Spider-Man comic, you could be in the middle of the rising action. You could be in the middle of the conclusion like you are somewhere in the Spider-Man comic story, which is not just the whole thing in one book. And our comic strips, which Garfield, Calvin and Hobbs and all that, they were showing up in the paper weekly.
[00:35:05] Mary: Sometimes they were standalone, but a lot of times if you followed one, the story kind of continued even though it was alone. So that's the difference between them and how the graphic novel has become its own unique format because it's the entire story. It is the novel and not just.
[00:35:23] Mary: The comic strip or the comic book. Which I think there's a lot of value. Calvin and Hobbs in particular, you wanna talk about vocabulary? Oh my goodness. Graphic novels and comic books will build vocabulary because they have to be very particular about the words they choose. So they're going to choose words with a lot of impact.
[00:35:40] Mary: And Calvin and Hobbs in particular uses high level humor and vocabulary and kids love it. Yes. Yes.
[00:35:48] Cait: Maybe that's why people don't think of them as quote unquote educational is cuz we liken them to Sunday morning comics. I wonder if
[00:35:55] Mary: that's Yeah. Like in our heads, we don't realize, again, like that you can teach the entire plot and all the literary elements through one graphic novel because it is a whole novel, just like any other
[00:36:09] Cait: book.
[00:36:10] Cait: I love it. It's approaching it with that like homeschooler educator spin because you could take, it's like when we talk about interest, like you could take any mundane interest that your kids have and make it interesting if you're willing to do a little digging and finding the things and ask the questions and have the conversation.
[00:36:27] Mary: Yes. And what I love is, it's one of the things that, there, there are amazing teachers out there who maybe are using some graphic novels in their class, but it's not as common because they do have all this pressure to hit certain titles and have to do certain books and all that. And we don't, yes, we can do like I did and spend the whole, I'm not suggesting everyone spends a whole year with graphic novels.
[00:36:50] Mary: That was a particular situation for a particular child. Not you, but somewhere out there, there's someone else with an artist in their house who struggles. And I remember turning to my husband and saying, let's be honest, if this child ever writes a book, It will be a graphic novel. So what better way to spend her time than to study the format, that she'll probably write in. So we laughed about that and we were like, yeah, it's pretty true. Like, why are we even fighting this? Let's spend a year studying it. And I was so glad as a homeschooler we can embrace that about a unique kid. So I didn't make everyone in my house do that, but that particular child did.
[00:37:32] Mary: And I'm so glad.
[00:37:32] Cait: And when you think if you had presented history in like a Na, Nathan Hale format versus read this textbook or workbook or whatever, just you're gonna just retain so much more. And teachers are tied by all of the things that they need to do. And you and I both worked in schools, so we remember that I did orientation for my daughter who did seventh grade this year.
[00:37:52] Cait: Public and. I immediately was like so relieved. The first teacher we met with was English and she had such a good library and I was looking at the titles and she had everything and I was like, have you read the Book Whisperer? And she was like, I love Donly Miller. I was like, oh, this is gonna be, this is good right here.
[00:38:09] Cait: She had all these rules, like basically there's, the only rule is enjoy the book that you have. If you don't like it, bring it back. I don't care. Read a line. Read, we'll f we'll find something for you. That's so good.
[00:38:19] Mary: Yeah, it was so good. That's fantastic.
[00:38:21] Cait: Thank goodness. I don't know far beyond seventh grade how you can do that, but
[00:38:25] Mary: Some years you win, some years you lose.
[00:38:28] Mary: Yeah. My oldest
[00:38:28] Cait: is like with to kill a mocking board bird. He was like, I loved this book. When I read it the first time, and this was in the fall, he's they're like beating a dead horse. Like how much more can we talk about it? I don't think I would've liked it. I was like, that's yep.
[00:38:42] Mary: That's public.
[00:38:43] Mary: That's all right there. And that's a great example of one that has a graphic adaptation. Yeah. To Kill a Mockingbird, an animal farm. I read that last summer. Animal Farm has a graphic adaptation that for such a sad book, the graphics are quite lovely.
[00:38:59] Cait: I have to go back and read that again. I had, I, we read Animal Farm in seventh grade and we hadn't done any of the history.
[00:39:06] Cait: And it was because our teacher got bumped from the high school down to the middle school and he was mad and he told us all the time and I was like, what is this? Even I don't understand. And then when we later in high school were learning, I was like, why did he, and I always hated it. Like I haven't gone back to revisit it cuz it was such a terrible experience of me being like, why are they all, why are the animals talking?
[00:39:31] Cait: I don't understand.
[00:39:32] Mary: What a great. Okay. Another great use of the graphic novel is if you're not teaching it for literature purposes, because there's value in reading the whole novel for literature, there's a lot more in it. But if you are trying, if your real goal is forms of government and that kind of thing, then why not pull the graphic novel? You don't need all the details of the novel. So again, also just evaluating your goals and keeping open to an a graphic novel might actually achieve the goal better than having to have your kid read the whole novel. If the goal isn't this literary, eight months dive into an arm, but more of an exposure to the concepts that you can then look at all the different commentaries there on government.
[00:40:17] Cait: Or if you have a kid that's really, that's in high school and is reading the original and the younger one is interested and wants There's a lot of themes there that were just like, he would, and he would ask us the history questions too, and I was like, I'm, good student.
[00:40:30] Cait: I was like so stressed out, like I don't under, this is so weird. And then as the year went on, it became apparent that Charlie was just really mad. He was really bitter about his placement.
[00:40:40] Mary: A bunch
[00:40:42] Cait: of seventh graders. So I'm assuming I'm gonna make an assumption that you're planning to do more of these graphic novel.
[00:40:49] Mary: I am. And it's crazy. I remember the first year thinking, okay, I'll pick these out and then I'll probably have to repeat a bunch. No, nope. I'm doing two and a half years worth now, and I have not repeated a graphic novel. So I think that was even shocking to me. As someone who reads graphic novels with their kids, that.
[00:41:08] Mary: They're just there's so many. I, it blows my mind. So I will be entering now the third year of a graphic novel a week in a weekly book club, and none of the titles will repeat. Wow.
[00:41:22] Cait: I love that. What do you know, and I'm putting you on the spot, when did they start becoming super popular?
[00:41:29] Cait: Like what were the first graphic novels? Were they
[00:41:32] Mary: eighties? That's a really great question. I'm, I don't know. Up later. You know what, I should look this up because I talk about them so much. Sorry, Mary, but I feel like the last decade has been a boom. Yeah. Just a boom,
[00:41:45] Cait: because I'm trying to think back to my teen years and I don't think, and maybe I just wasn't accusing, I don't remember reading one, no, like Calvin and Hobbs and things like that, but not, I don't remember any like graphic type novels.
[00:41:58] Cait: It would be like, I remember
[00:41:59] Mary: the first thing that, now you got me curious. I looked on Google, I
[00:42:02] Cait: remember Jerome Stilton, like my kids were really into that for a while, and that was like our first like dabble in, I don't know that's considered a graphic novel, but like all the font changes and things like that.
[00:42:13] Cait: Oh yeah,
[00:42:14] Mary: there's another whole one there. There was, technically, the first one was in 1783, but I don't think you gotta cover that one. I don't think it was real popular. And then we had it looks like 1974, there was a series called The First Kingdom, and it described itself as the first graphic novel.
[00:42:36] Mary: But again, when we're looking at like the first one or two coming out, I think obviously the last 10 years has been a huge boom.
[00:42:47] Mary: From what I can see. Now I wanna look at
[00:42:49] Cait: the kingdom.
[00:42:50] Mary: I didn't know what was that?
[00:42:52] Cait: I wonder if it was like gaming,
[00:42:54] Mary: like the, I could see, I dunno. I dunno.
[00:42:56] Cait: Yeah, we're going off on a whole tangent. I can talk to you whole forever, Mary. I can talk to you forever, but I'm gonna switch to rapid fire if that's okay with you.
[00:43:05] Mary: Okay. Are you ready for it? Ready, go over me. I
[00:43:08] Cait: wanna do the Taylor Swift voice, but I'll spare you. When you were little, what did you wanna be when
[00:43:12] Mary: you grew up a teacher
[00:43:14] Cait: and you were ding like triple accomplish teacher homeschooler, online teacher. What was your favorite childhood game or toy?
[00:43:22] Mary: Ooh game back in the day, it was called Rubik's Race. And it's now called Square Up, I think. We have a version called Square Up where it wasn't a Rubik's Cube, but it was like, what are those puzzles called? Where you shift the blocks around? Yes.
[00:43:38] Cait: It's that kind a puzzle in goodie bags
[00:43:41] Mary: at birthday parties.
[00:43:42] Mary: Yeah. And you would shake this Rubik's cube and it would lay a side down with nine colors and you would have to race the other person to make it that nine color match. I still consider myself the all-time champion of that game.
[00:43:56] Mary: Just,
[00:43:56] Cait: what was your favorite book as
[00:43:58] Mary: a kid? The Nancy Drew series. I couldn't pick one, but I read them all the time. That was my favorite. The originals too, like the old school. Oh yeah. I had all the yellow bind. Yes. The hard covers, hard cover.
[00:44:12] Cait: I had them all, I had those at her house and My cousins were boys, like close in age to me, and so my brothers would be playing and I'd just read Nancy Drew.
[00:44:19] Cait: That always makes me think of her house. Yes. My favorite. So good. What is the best book you've read or books in the last five or so years? I know it's a terrible question.
[00:44:29] Mary: This is a terrible question. Here's how I'm gonna answer it. I am going to answer it with what is the the best memoir I've read because, or the most interesting because I'm on a memoir kick.
[00:44:45] Mary: So I thought, you know what? I love memoirs. I've read a ton of memoirs recently and the one that was most intriguing for me was Matthew McConaughey Really? It's weird. Okay.
[00:44:56] Cait: This is always pushed to me and I'm like, stop it with the algorithm. Like what? Cuz I'm not at, I don't, he's fine. Yeah. But I'm not like, like a mathematical, I
[00:45:06] Mary: only followed him in his romcom is his romcom face.
[00:45:09] Mary: Yeah. And it's actually his least favorite movies he's ever done. Which I learned in the book. Interesting. I never saw Dazed and Confused, but I loved his stories about the, about that movie. And he's just a really interesting, weird guy. And so I just enjoyed his he had wisdom in that book that I wish I was listening on audio and I wish I had the book to write it down.
[00:45:32] Mary: There were just those tidbits that you're like, wow, that's a really great thought. Matthew McConaughey. I had no idea you were this deep. And then he's talking about swimming naked in the Amazon River he's just an odd guy and it was a enjoyable read. So I will say that was my favorite memoir.
[00:45:47] Mary: Didn't he get arrested
[00:45:48] Cait: for playing bongos naked or something in his yard or something? Yes. It's two
[00:45:52] Mary: in the morning. He talks all about that Uhhuh and now he refused to get dressed cuz he was so angry. He was like, no, you arrested me naked. Take me naked. So he's just a very odd guy and I enjoyed his story and his wisdom.
[00:46:04] Mary: I've quoted some of his stuff because I just, I don't know, again, I don't wanna hype it up too much. No. Cause I
[00:46:11] Cait: was surprise, I'm gonna, I'm gonna see if our library has it or if somebody has it. Cuz it's constantly, like at any time I get like an audible ad or anything, it's always hits and I'm like, do you think I'm like a super fan or something?
[00:46:22] Cait: Like constantly. But it also is like intriguing because he is, when you see him in interviews and things he's quirky.
[00:46:29] Mary: He, quirky is a great word, and this book confirms quirky, but yet there's this very, and I think artists do have a lot of these like deep inner lives, just as a generalization.
[00:46:40] Mary: So you get this glimpse into his unique journey, into acting and then like his deep inner thought life. It is adult. I wanna make that very clear on the podcast. This, he is very comfortable talking about some adult things that maybe I didn't wanna know about him. May maybe the bongos is a little, the bongos story, just is a little precursor.
[00:47:02] Mary: Yeah. Yeah. You get a little more than that and you can just, we'll leave it at that. But I really I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. Okay.
[00:47:09] Cait: And I wanna read the book and not cuz I like his voice, but. Does he read
[00:47:14] Mary: that? That's why I listened to the Audible, but I really did miss not having a highlighter for some of this occasional amazing thought that would come out.
[00:47:22] Mary: And I really liked it too. I've been doing a lot of memoirs because my favorite, you didn't ask this, but here's another rapid fire I'll give myself. What's your favorite genre, Mary? It's actually like psychological thrillers. But I think there's why, there's,
[00:47:33] Cait: there can be overlaps there. I like both of those two memoir is my favorite.
[00:47:38] Cait: But I think something that makes the memoirs especially interesting is when it's got some wild story or educated, where
[00:47:46] Mary: you're like, oh yeah, did you read, I'm glad my mother died. We're getting off, but, oh no. Jeanette McCurdy, who I did not watch. Was she on iCarly, some Nickelodeon show?
[00:47:57] Mary: She's a famous actress and she wrote a memoir called I'm Glad My Mother Died. And Wow. Yeah. It's it's very similar in theme to educated. Okay.
[00:48:08] Cait: It's okay then. I need to get that one too. Oh, Mary, you're gonna be filling my card. You can't tell my husband. Did you library had it memoir while we're on a memoir conversation one that I listened to on Audible lately when I had recently when I had a credit, was the one by bono and he
[00:48:24] Mary: sings in it.
[00:48:25] Mary: Oh. That just went on my list this week.
[00:48:27] Cait: Yeah, it, I've heard its really good. It was really good. Really good. Okay. And I would highly rec, I didn't read it obviously cuz I wanted, I knew that he sang on it. And I like you too. I'm not a super fan, but it was really well done, I thought.
[00:48:39] Cait: And just listening to his voice just nice. I love when you have a good breathing. Yeah. So I would recommend that one too. Who?
[00:48:46] Mary: Yeah. Philly MyChart.
[00:48:48] Cait: What is bringing you joy right now?
[00:48:50] Mary: What is bringing joy right now? The ex. Okay. I know this sounds silly because it's May and it's so busy, but I wanna say the extra time to handle that busyness, like not having school. I'm sorry. I'm just, I was very done with school. I know some people school year round and it's great and that's wonderful, but I've always been very done and ready for a break.
[00:49:10] Mary: So it is bringing me joy to just walk up to Duncan with my son and not have to take math, but just to walk up and then sit and play Uno and walk back. This
[00:49:20] Cait: is making me wanna be done cuz we, so my youngest might go to, might try school in the fall, and so I have, on the one hand I have, this is this might be our last month homeschooling, but on the other hand I'm it's, I'm over it.
[00:49:33] Cait: We're done. We're both the weather's finally nice, even though we had a frost the other day. Random frost after everybody plants everything. But the weather's finally nice and I'm just like, why? And knowing that too, that went to school were fine. If you're worry. They were all like, am I gonna be behind?
[00:49:50] Cait: And they were fine. They're fine. So I'm like, do I just stop?
[00:49:54] Mary: Yeah. I think you declare today, the last day you bake something and you're potentially
[00:50:00] Cait: so funny. Oh, Mary, it's always so fun to chat with you. I wish we lives closer. If I can just like tug North Carolina up here. I know.
[00:50:07] Mary: Serious. No, you're a little cold.
[00:50:09] Mary: We're gonna just tug you down this way. Yeah, you're right.
[00:50:12] Cait: Before we go, could you, and I'll put everything in the show notes, but could you tell everybody where they can find you?
[00:50:18] Mary: Yes, they can find [email protected] is the website. And then on all the social media, I'm either Mary Hannah Wilson or Mary Wilson blog.
[00:50:29] Mary: So Instagram and TikTok are my favorite two places. That is where you will find me doing very different things on those two platforms. But I love them both. So if you use Instagram or if you use TikTok, I'm in both of those places. Thank you so much for
[00:50:45] Cait: coming on.
[00:50:46] Mary: You're welcome. Thank you for having me.
[00:50:48] Mary: Bye. Goodbye.
[00:50:50]
